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Nokia launches 41MP Lumia 1020 for Windows Phone 8

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Nokia today announced the Lumia 1020, its 41MP cameraphone running Windows Phone 8.

After months of widespread rumors and leaks, Finnish handset maker Nokia today officially launches its latest flagship Windows cameraphone, the Lumia 1020, at a press event in New York City. The headline spec is, of course, the Lumia 1020's 41MP imaging sensor, an iteration of the groundbreaking technology the company debuted last year in the 808 PureView phone

This time around though, Nokia has paired their photo enthusiast smartphone with the Windows Phone 8 OS, Zeiss six-element lens and improved image processing. The camera creates two images simultaneously for each capture. One file is saved at the sensor's full resolution. The second image, suitable for sharing, is a 5MP capture.  The benefit here is that you can zoom in and out non-destructively post-capture.

As with the Lumia 925, an optical image stabilization system is present. This one though has been redesigned with a ball-bearing housing and tiny audible motors that are activated to keep the sensor and lens on the same plane.

Also new is a Nokia-developed app, dubbed Pro Cam. Manual camera controls include ISO, shutter speed, exposure compensation, white balacnce and manual focus. Nokia also announced a partnership with Hipstamatic in which the camera app maker will launch Oggl Pro alongside the release of the Lumia 1020.

And because no true camera-oriented device would be complete without accessories, there's a snap-on camera grip that provides a shutter release, tripod socket and a sculpted hand grip. A snap-on wireles charging shell, as seen on previous Lumia models will be avilable as well.

The Lumia 1020 will be available in yellow, back and white color schemes. In the U.S. The Lumia 1020 will be avilable exclusively from AT&T. Devices will be in retail stores on July 26 and you can place a pre-order on the AT&T site beginning July 16. Nokia promises that the Lumia 1020 will be available in China and parts of Europe, "in this quarter."

The Lumia 1020 uses the PureView technology from the Nokia 808, housed in a design reminiscent of recent Lumia models like the 925.
The Lumia 1020 features a Zeiss six-element lens which sits in front of a 41MP imaging sensor.
Nokia offers a $79 camera grip the provides a shutter release, additional battery and contoured hand grip.
The 1020, like its Lumia stablemates, can be used with a wireless charging shell.

 

Comments

Total comments: 147
NikonWins
By NikonWins (2 months ago)

I wish everyone would STOP trying to compare their cell phones with REAL WORLD camera`s and DSLR`s! As a professional photographer, I have evolved from the FILM age, and made that inevitable jump to digital. That being said, the 41 MP Nokia cannot and will never replace a good dslr. You cannot, unless you are photographically inclined, even imagine the capabilities and advantages a DSLR have over a cell phone....so plz, just end this silly argument. ALL OF YOU FOOLED BY THE "41MP" PITCH have NO CLUE there is soooo much more to a great photo, and aside from that, there is NO WAY you could ever tell the difference in say a 3x5 photo with the naked eye between 10MP and 41MP. So, buy a damn camera!!

0 upvotes
Chikoo
By Chikoo (9 months ago)

This is in an extremely dimly lit coal mine in PA captured using my Lumia 920. My brother using a Nikon D80 had no alternative but to use a flash.

http://i.imgur.com/BU52xxS.jpg

1 upvote
NikonWins
By NikonWins (2 months ago)

Ok, so your brother had to use a flash because the image sensors dictated the Nikon D80 to fire a flash. Why don't you post both YOUR pic, and your Brothers D80 pic? Side by side and no changing the DSLR original. I`d like to see both in comparison.

0 upvotes
Chikoo
By Chikoo (9 months ago)

Check out the DOF on my Lumia 920 in macro mode

http://i.imgur.com/nQ8vkSn.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/WxFbtWn.jpg

0 upvotes
Chikoo
By Chikoo (9 months ago)

For those still wondering about the 41mp, this is a must read from Nokia. It provides you an insight in enough detail without making you go crazy. Like digital camera technology for dummies!!!

http://i.nokia.com/blob/view/-/2723846/data/1/-/Lumia1020-whitepaper.pdf

3 upvotes
CortoPA
By CortoPA (9 months ago)

Thanks, Good read.

0 upvotes
mmacleodbrown
By mmacleodbrown (9 months ago)

As a 920 owner, Im going to move to this as soon as it is out. The best camera is the one you have with you has proved to be so true for me, I have taken over 1200 shots with my 920.
I understand the smaller pixel pitch will give more noise, but Im happy with my 920 and this will be a big step up from that, so Im looking forward to this.
As for the dual core old chipset, WP8 is highly optimised and I have yet to notice any real lag, and hopefully the additional 1Gb of RAM will help with the large image file processing.

3 upvotes
Alexis D
By Alexis D (9 months ago)

So, Nokia finally decides to put its nice camera features on other than a Symbian phone. Too bad it's Windows. People don't care much how good the physical bits in a smartphone unless it has the right OS, and the apps, i.e. either Android or Apple. Software, Nokia, software is even more important as hardware is already so good on most phones. Hardware gets obsolete quickly. Time is valuable, and the users' experiences are much more important than yet another proprietary OS and having to re-learn a new OS, GUI etc. Nokia has gone from the top mobile maker to this. It needs to have more commercial sense and learn about what consumers want what and not just great hardware.

Comment edited 4 times, last edit 7 minutes after posting
2 upvotes
YiannisPP
By YiannisPP (9 months ago)

Speak for yourself. I couldn't care less about the OS, I'm not a fashion victim like you seem to be. The new Lumia phones are just very good and there is no app I'm missing. Oh and the Nokia navigation on my 820 is better than any real GPS device or app out there, I've used in 4 different countries so far (with mobile data turned off as I had the maps predownloded, so completely free) and it worked like a dream. Something all the iPhone and Android users could only marvel at. Plus I've seen way too many IPhone and S£ users drop their phones and break them. Flimsy things. Drop a Lumia and nothing happens, as good as new.

2 upvotes
Chikoo
By Chikoo (9 months ago)

I find it pathetic that so many pro folks are enamored by the size of the lens or the size of the sensor or the size of the pixels.

I would have hoped by now, over the last 5 years of rapid technology growth, you would have realized the only thing that matters is quality. Quality of Lens, Quality of sensor, Quality of pixels, and most importantly in this day and age, the quality of the camera software.

For example, My Nokia Lumia 920 takes better pictures in the dark than my Panasonic FZ10 with a F2.8 Leica lens.

Compare them side by side over here:

http://mbworld.org/forums/off-topic/505750-low-light-performance-nokia-lumia-920-a.html

1 upvote
brdeveloper
By brdeveloper (9 months ago)

Are you comparing a 10-year-old FZ10 with a sensor as small as L920? Doesn't look a fair comparison.

On the other side, probably FZ10 has a better IQ at daylight.

1 upvote
Chikoo
By Chikoo (9 months ago)

My point exactly. Technology has evolved so much that to pin results on size of lens or sensor is almost idiotic. Relatively it would make a difference, but in absolute terms even a small sensor of today outperforms a large sensor from yesteryears.

0 upvotes
Petrogel
By Petrogel (9 months ago)

Yes you are right it is pathetic, but not as pathetic as comparing this phone camera with a DSLR, that some agonizingly trying to prove !!!

0 upvotes
vv50
By vv50 (9 months ago)

yes Petrogel!!! Please remind everyone that you are the one comparing the phone with DSLRs!

2 upvotes
Petrogel
By Petrogel (9 months ago)

MOI ?? No !! you are !

0 upvotes
Alpha Whiskey Photography
By Alpha Whiskey Photography (9 months ago)

I get along fine with my humble 12MP N8.

http://alphawhiskey.slickpic.com/photoblog/post/TheBestCamera

1 upvote
falconeyes
By falconeyes (9 months ago)

Quite a disappointment.
The 1020 uses 1.1 µm pixels where the 808 PV uses 1.4 µm pixels. That's quite a large difference, increasing the crop factor from 3.3 (almost like the 2.7 crop of 1" systems) to 4.2. The 35mm-equivalent aperture is F/9.3 (was F/7.9). The 808PV was about diffraction-limited at the center, so this directly translates to a loss of pixel contrast (the 40% difference in light gathering may or may not be covered by BSI technology).

So, while the 808PV rivals the Nikon 1 and Sony RX100, the 1020 only aims to rival enthusiast compacts. Quite a disppointment.

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 4 minutes after posting
2 upvotes
yabokkie
By yabokkie (9 months ago)

sensor format is only part of the story.
the less important part.

0 upvotes
Gadgety
By Gadgety (9 months ago)

Thank you for pointing this out. It also goes to show what happens when all the focus in the market is to make phones as slim as possible. Even quite a few comments are about "bulk" compared to the 920 (!) and other smartphones. As for the BSI technology making the pixels more responsive to light, it'll be enlightening to read the photgraphic/video reviews.

0 upvotes
Rage Joe
By Rage Joe (9 months ago)

Please,

I've already asked this many times on this forum, but no answers. So I ask it again. Please tell me:

What was all that talk - that "serious photographers" with tons of glass loved - that small lenses just couldn't resolve (due to bla bla bla....) ? What was it?

I mean this. I want to know. Where are the limits, and what are they?

:rj

1 upvote
Nathebeach
By Nathebeach (9 months ago)

A. Larger sensor (not lens) allows you to isolate your subject. What is the subject of a wedding photo? The bride and groom. You want the background to be out of focus intentionally and a larger sensor makes that far easier, and far more natural looking.
B. Low light. Large sensor means better performance in low light. There are exceptions but that is a general truth.
C. Contrast. Larger sensors equal better contrast. YES there are exceptions, but look at the Olympus "professional" E-5 camera. VERY NICE photos, but in difficult light or extreme light, it struggles. Not bad, but it needs a little more help in post processing.
D. You should notice a pattern in my answers. It is not the lens size that matters. It is the sensor size that matters. Also cramming that many pixels in a small sensor means grainy photos; pixels = heat. I predict HEAVY filtering on the Nokia images and excessive filtering reduces detail. I shoot with my noise filters off or set to low or as needed.

3 upvotes
xMichaelx
By xMichaelx (9 months ago)

If you don't know the role played by the sensor, then it's no wonder you couldn't understand the answers to your questions.

0 upvotes
Rage Joe
By Rage Joe (9 months ago)

Resolution

I was asking about RESOLUTION of a lens, not about the role of the sensor, or low light performance, or the ability to isolate subjects from the background. Those are completely different things.

Resolution.

1 upvote
Nathebeach
By Nathebeach (9 months ago)

Simple. A lens with great resolving power is worthless if the sensor can only resolve detail down to a certain level.

If a lens can resolve down to, say .1 arc seconds in detail but the sensor is only capable of resolving .2 arc seconds, then it is kind of pointless to spend money on that great espensive lens if the sensor can't pick up the detail. Resolving power is directly related to aperture, but that only applies if you have quality glass that resists flare, difraction, and so on.

I am speaking generally thinking back to my astronomy days. I think the ring gap in Saturn's rings are around 0.5 arc seconds, but don't quote me on that.

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 9 minutes after posting
0 upvotes
zodiacfml
By zodiacfml (9 months ago)

it's because the lens on the nokia is more precise than what is found on a typical dslr lens. as nokia, mentioned before, 10 times better. i guess you could search for more details.

1 upvote
Rage Joe
By Rage Joe (9 months ago)

Yeah, but I have been just wondering about that bulls talk that has been around among photographers, that you need a bigger lens to get better resolution.

Seems like you don't.

Does this have something to do with the recent development of optical glass?

I suppose if we had ideal, flawless optical glass and absolutely flawless optical design of a lens the size wouldn't have any effect on the image ( having proportionally the same size of a sensor for the lens ) at least with the F -numbers arranged so that the depth of field is equal.

So what this all boils down to is that once the sensor technology gets better and better we are starting to get more and more even quality out of cameras of any size of sensor.

Comment edited 11 minutes after posting
1 upvote
Petrogel
By Petrogel (9 months ago)

This lens is 10 times better ? from what? scuttle of a boat ? ROFL

1 upvote
Chikoo
By Chikoo (9 months ago)

Nathebeach --> you are basically referring to the flexibility offered in the DOF as a result of a larger capture media, be it a sensor or camera roll. right?

0 upvotes
TheProv
By TheProv (9 months ago)

I did some math.

1020: crop factor 3.93 , lens F2.4, equivalent aperture (depth of field) is F8,646

808 Crop factor 3.24, Lens F2.2, equivalent aperture (depth of field) is F7,776

Also, made 35mm area 0 stop, 1020 has -3.89 stops less, 808 -3.34. It's half a stop of difference between them.

So, i believe in ideal conditions (daylight, tripod, ISO 100), 808 will potentially still give a little better results than 1020, but accounting BSI technology and OIS, in many other situations differences will be subtle.

3 upvotes
yabokkie
By yabokkie (9 months ago)

> equivalent aperture (depth of field)

no need to mention "depth of field"
all the effects that aperture can control are the same (equivalent), or nothing is non-equivalent, nobody can find one.

btw, my calculation is 3.4 for 808.

Comment edited 1 minute after posting
0 upvotes
falconeyes
By falconeyes (9 months ago)

The pixel sizes are 1.1µm and 1.4µm resp. The difference in crop factor should reflect that, like 4.2 vs. 3.3.

0 upvotes
halc
By halc (9 months ago)

Look at the samples and you can forget about your math: the quality in well light conditions is worse (noise + highlights). Dark might be different story.

1 upvote
TheProv
By TheProv (9 months ago)

Halc

What you said is exactly what i wrote.... -_-

0 upvotes
vetsmelter
By vetsmelter (9 months ago)

"41MP Nokia Lumia 1020 brings PureView camera tech to Windows Phone"
So after almost one year, it is now official? http://www.technobuffalo.com/2012/08/31/nokia-lumia-820-lumia-920-to-bring-pureview-technology-to-windows-phone-8/

I was hoping for an improvement over the 808
But I was expecting to get the same (just Windows Phone trying to catch up with Symbian)
Now it seems we are getting less (smaller sensor)

But still a good intermediate release. And the camera module breaks the sterile and generic design of the Lumia, providing improved handgrip in Elops sweaty, restless sausage fingers.

Besides moving from the 2nd best Camera phone, Nokia N8, to the best Camera phone Pureview 808 took almost 2 years as well.
If the old Nokia has still some R&D tricks to pull out the closet, we may see the next major update in 2014.

2 upvotes
Zlik
By Zlik (9 months ago)

Actually, if you take the whole camera module into account, the 1020 is an improvement over the 808 in a lot of areas, even though the 808 has a slight edge in sensor size.
I think adding image stabilization and being able to do so in a thinner package is quite a feat, and the only compromise they had to make is to shrink the sensor slightly, which still is much bigger that every other smartphone.

4 upvotes
brdeveloper
By brdeveloper (9 months ago)

I'll wait for the next BSI generation, maybe on the Nokia 1120. I expect that this phone will outperform L920, iPhone 5 and GS4, but not 808.

On the plus side, it will give stabilized videos which is nice for videomakers. As I make more still pictures than videos, I'd prefer buying N808 at this moment.

Also, currently Symbian has a better package of built-in features than WP8: fm transmitter, native micro-hdmi port, usb-otg, sd slot and replaceable battery. Also, a mature navigator/map suite.

2 upvotes
Gadgety
By Gadgety (9 months ago)

"If the old Nokia has still some R&D tricks to pull out the closet, we may see the next major update in 2014."

Of course they do. And how far away is 3D?

0 upvotes
Savic76
By Savic76 (9 months ago)

Sony xperia i1 2/3" is same 1/1.5", do maths, 2/3=0.6666 , 1/1.5=0.6666.

2 upvotes
Earthlight
By Earthlight (9 months ago)

I second the wish for RAW capability. That would be awesome.

2 upvotes
vetsmelter
By vetsmelter (9 months ago)

If Nokia would have stuck with their Maemo (Linux) OS like on the N900 you would have had RAW to play with only weeks after the release.
http://www.slashgear.com/fcam-adds-raw-and-hdr-capture-to-nokia-n900-2294918/

However, I can tell you that after experimeting with the RAW images, it is very hard to match the same pleasing effect the in camera software produces. These devices with tiny lenses are tweaked to the max through software.

2 upvotes
Eigenmeat
By Eigenmeat (9 months ago)

only if it can shoot raw...

1 upvote
vv50
By vv50 (9 months ago)

if the need for raw is the only thing holding you back, then you've got other problems

1 upvote
ET2
By ET2 (9 months ago)

Rumored Xperia i1 (google) is supposed to have 2/3" sensor

1 upvote
cocopro
By cocopro (9 months ago)

SONY i1 is rumored to have the same sensor size, <3 competition.

1 upvote
Peiasdf
By Peiasdf (9 months ago)

My biggest problem with this phone is the low end hardware on the phone part. It uses virtually the same innards as the 920, an one year old phone that's pretty behind the time when it comes out.

2 upvotes
ptox
By ptox (9 months ago)

And the practical downside is... ?

2 upvotes
wmac
By wmac (9 months ago)

WP has lower hardware requirements than Android. That's why a quad core has not practically been used for any WP. Besides the 2G RAM is very good.

9 upvotes
Zlik
By Zlik (9 months ago)

The 920 runs extremely smoothly even after 6 months of use, whereas you can't say the same thing for most android devices that have higher specs. WP8 has a much better optimization. And the 1020 has double the RAM of the 920. Have you ever used a 920? Or is it just the specs on paper that matter to you ?

5 upvotes
Peiasdf
By Peiasdf (9 months ago)

@ptox
Slower HDR capture rate, simplier JPEG engine, longer time to start camera, higher power usage. You really cannot see the advantage of technological advancement?

@wmac
Still, some improvement beside the RAM would have been nice. After all, it is a piece of technology and I would assume it take a lot more power to downsample that 41mp image vs. 920’s 8.7mp image.

@Zlik
Played with it and it is definitely smoother than even the new Galaxy S4 but like what people says about iPhone (which I am using), Android brute hardware strength begin to overshadow even better optimizations.

1 upvote
Chikoo
By Chikoo (9 months ago)

O Lord. Another one enamored by size. This time the size of the processor.

0 upvotes
ptox
By ptox (9 months ago)

@Peiasdf: those are theoretical advantages. Unless you have evidence that the 920 (or 1020) hardware is a hindrance in practise, you're just blowing smoke.

2 upvotes
Rage Joe
By Rage Joe (9 months ago)

Design an efficient OS and you need much less processing power. Just a hint.

1 upvote
Soodeep Dev
By Soodeep Dev (9 months ago)

I have used Symbian, Android, iOS and WP8,.......all are okay for me. Where I used my phone is for telephone, text, internet and the most Photography. I have been using my Nokia N8 for all most two years and no problems at all. It's only a matter of choice whether you use android, iOS or WP.....I have used PV 808 and loved that beast and 1020 will be my new beast. The only point is OS never matter it's your choice and how well you can go along.......

3 upvotes
SammyToronto
By SammyToronto (9 months ago)

If only they'd offer an Android version! I know it won't happen, but one can only dream..

4 upvotes
vv50
By vv50 (9 months ago)

wait some years for sony to come up with something

1 upvote
David Stephen
By David Stephen (9 months ago)

I'm interested to see the wb on this beast. I almost purchased the Nokia Lumia 920, but the wb was crap on skin tones, just like every android phone. In my opinion, no phone matches iPhones sharpness and skin tone capabilities.

2 upvotes
vv50
By vv50 (9 months ago)

no well known phone perhaps. the n8 skin tone rendition has been trouncing phones even before the 808

3 upvotes
jdpatl
By jdpatl (9 months ago)

It's adjustable. Of course there's auto mode, but if it's a big deal, then you can tweak it.

0 upvotes
Lan
By Lan (9 months ago)

The lack of image stabilization was my only real bugbear with the 808, so well done to Nokia for fixing that!

8 upvotes
ezradja
By ezradja (9 months ago)

Samsung Galaxy S4 Zoom real (and only) competitor so far ...

2 upvotes
Zlik
By Zlik (9 months ago)

The Galaxy S4 Zoom with its tiny, minuscule sensor ? No.

9 upvotes
Craig Atkinson
By Craig Atkinson (9 months ago)

I'm looking forward to that sony phone with similar specs to the RX100

3 upvotes
supeyugin1
By supeyugin1 (9 months ago)

This would be awesome. Imagine how much Sony is going to charge for such phone.

1 upvote
reach0775
By reach0775 (9 months ago)

Mr. Photato, I'm afraid you're wrong. What you say is what was also my first opinion, as a photographer and as an engineer. However, my brother owns a 808 and the results are stunning. The trick with the downscaling works!
I'd never by this or the 808 due to the OS, but the image quality is amazing!

Comment edited 25 seconds after posting
7 upvotes
AngryCorgi
By AngryCorgi (9 months ago)

Well done, Nokia. Well done. Now, Apple just needs to buddy-up with Nokia and make a phone I want with an imaging sensor I want.

1 upvote
Photato
By Photato (9 months ago)

DPReview comments about the Nikon D800E (36mp) full frame DSLR:
"Pushing these cameras to achieve their maximum level of detail requires an investment of both time (methodical preparation) and money (the very best lenses Nikon makes). "
41mp is a marketing gimmick...

1 upvote
AngryCorgi
By AngryCorgi (9 months ago)

41MP is NOT a marketing gimmick. The results prove this.

26 upvotes
ET2
By ET2 (9 months ago)

Guess what? The image quality is far better than Pentax Q.

5 upvotes
Lars Rehm
By Lars Rehm (9 months ago)

You are not meant to even use the 41MP images. They are only used for down sampling and cropping which worked extremely well on the 808. The phone gives you the option to save the 41MP image but that's not the point of the concept.

8 upvotes
Rage Joe
By Rage Joe (9 months ago)

Surely I will use that 38 MP. Of course. Why not. It's working fine!

Just check that plastic Earth- ball in a picture taken with a Nokia 808 in that dpreview's Studio shot comparison tool. 808 outresolves almost all the DSLR's. Heeh! How was it that tiny lenses can't resolve... bla bla bla.. and then you get this

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/studio-compare#baseDir=%2Freviews_data&cameraDataSubdir=boxshot&indexFileName=boxshotindex.xml&presetsFileName=boxshotpresets.xml&showDescriptions=false&headerTitle=Studio%20scene&headerSubTitle=Standard%20studio%20scene%20comparison&masterCamera=nokia_pureview808&masterSample=2012-07-20-0457&slotsCount=4&slot0Camera=nokia_pureview808&slot0Sample=2012-07-20-0457&slot0DisableCameraSelection=true&slot0DisableSampleSelection=true&slot0LinkWithMaster=true&slot1Camera=nikon_d800e&slot1Sample=dsc_0087&slot2Camera=nikon_d7100&slot2Sample=dsc_0162&slot3Camera=canon_eos5dmkiii&slot3Sample=5d3_5199&x=-0.27194256828511937&y=1.209516054661301

4 upvotes
draleks
By draleks (9 months ago)

Are you referring to those nice wave-like patterns on the globe, especially in the oceans? Is it possible to be sure that it's not moiré of some sort? It seems to be much more pronounced on Nikon D800E and actually also on Pentax 645D. Neither of those have anti-aliasing filters. On the other cameras that I checked, the oceans appear uniformly blue.

Also consider the detail level on other locations on the studio shot, such as this: http://tinyurl.com/l2pzpmv. Lumia loses squarely to Canon S110, as it of course should.

Comment edited 3 times, last edit 14 minutes after posting
0 upvotes
TrojMacReady
By TrojMacReady (9 months ago)

@ Draleks:
That's a DOF/focus difference in part due to the different FL's used, not really relevant to the discussion of resolution.

I'm also not sure why "of course it should lose squarely" against the Canon S110.

Comment edited 7 minutes after posting
2 upvotes
draleks
By draleks (9 months ago)

Good point, the playing card is simply out of focus on Lumina. On the other cameras they stopped down the aperture.

0 upvotes
jdpatl
By jdpatl (9 months ago)

Lumia. Not Lumina.

0 upvotes
Rage Joe
By Rage Joe (9 months ago)

@draleks
Look at this then:

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/studio-compare#baseDir=%2Freviews_data&cameraDataSubdir=boxshot&indexFileName=boxshotindex.xml&presetsFileName=boxshotpresets.xml&showDescriptions=false&headerTitle=Studio%20scene&headerSubTitle=Standard%20studio%20scene%20comparison&masterCamera=nokia_pureview808&masterSample=2012-07-20-0457&slotsCount=4&slot0Camera=nokia_pureview808&slot0Sample=2012-07-20-0457&slot0DisableCameraSelection=true&slot0DisableSampleSelection=true&slot0LinkWithMaster=true&slot1Camera=nikon_d800e&slot1Sample=dsc_0087&slot2Camera=nikon_d7100&slot2Sample=dsc_0162&slot3Camera=canon_eos5dmkiii&slot3Sample=5d3_5199&x=-0.8263964997238856&y=1.326524773641851&extraCameraCount=0

1 upvote
Rage Joe
By Rage Joe (9 months ago)

Isn't this maddening. my dslr is sheet.

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/studio-compare#baseDir=%2Freviews_data&cameraDataSubdir=boxshot&indexFileName=boxshotindex.xml&presetsFileName=boxshotpresets.xml&showDescriptions=false&headerTitle=Studio%20scene&headerSubTitle=Standard%20studio%20scene%20comparison&masterCamera=nokia_pureview808&masterSample=2012-07-20-0457&slotsCount=4&slot0Camera=nokia_pureview808&slot0Sample=2012-07-20-0457&slot0DisableCameraSelection=true&slot0DisableSampleSelection=true&slot0LinkWithMaster=true&slot1Camera=nikon_d800e&slot1Sample=dsc_0087&slot2Camera=nikon_d7100&slot2Sample=dsc_0162&slot3Camera=canon_eos5dmkiii&slot3Sample=5d3_5199&x=-0.7428486470413318&y=-0.8156348507712944&extraCameraCount=0

Even Gorilla glass they have.

me tarzan you jane,
:rj

1 upvote
Rage Joe
By Rage Joe (9 months ago)

The Horrible King of Diffraction

Please. Could someone now, please, tell me what was all that boring talk that so many photographers have been dragging on for years, that small lenses can't resolve. I'm serious about this.
What was all that talk? About all sorts of problems that would occur if you trusted small lenses. The Horrible King of Diffraction and all The Dark Knights to come along. C'mon folks, please tell me, can't see too many of them here.

me tarzan you jane,
:rj

1 upvote
Chikoo
By Chikoo (9 months ago)

Even better example is the letters on the paper down below

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/studio-compare#baseDir=%2Freviews_data&cameraDataSubdir=boxshot&indexFileName=boxshotindex.xml&presetsFileName=boxshotpresets.xml&showDescriptions=false&headerTitle=Studio%20scene&headerSubTitle=Standard%20studio%20scene%20comparison&masterCamera=nokia_pureview808&masterSample=2012-07-20-0457&slotsCount=4&slot0Camera=nokia_pureview808&slot0Sample=2012-07-20-0457&slot0DisableCameraSelection=true&slot0DisableSampleSelection=true&slot0LinkWithMaster=true&slot1Camera=nikon_d800e&slot1Sample=dsc_0087&slot2Camera=nikon_d7100&slot2Sample=dsc_0162&slot3Camera=canon_eos5dmkiii&slot3Sample=5d3_5199&x=0.18757062146892664&y=-1.6616978957075788&extraCameraCount=0

0 upvotes
draleks
By draleks (9 months ago)

@Rage, who says that the lens is small? The aperture is 8.02/2.4 = 3.33 mm wide. The aperture on the m43 14mm F3.5 kit lens is for comparison 14/3.5 = 4 mm wide. Nokia lens has a shorter flange-to-sensor distance. This means higher angle of incidence for the sensor. I heard this could be a problem, but I do know know exactly in what way.

There is a nice explanation about diffraction here: http://tinyurl.com/7zkcd. Nokia 808 is not diffraction limited, due to the relatively large sensor size. On a 1/3'' sensor, 16 MP would be diffraction-limited even with a wide aperture.

Check out this before you throw out your DSLR: http://tinyurl.com/nmp3lc6. This is also a very bad omen: http://tinyurl.com/qzopzlc. But yes, 808 seems to hold its ground against the digicams, at least as long as you don't need the zoom or aperture control.

@Chikoo, Lumia is much closer to the scene than the other cams, so it has a better angle on the text.

Comment edited 1 minute after posting
0 upvotes
Photato
By Photato (9 months ago)

You'll need a tripod to get 41mp worth of resolution, good light and when subject is still. Or when seeing resolution charts in review sites.
In the real world however, when handheld, 41mp is a blurry mess.
Bigger pixels is the way to go. Just like DSLRs

0 upvotes
TrojMacReady
By TrojMacReady (9 months ago)

I doubt they were using a tripod on some of the shots taken from the helicopter... ;)
And while not 33MP of true resolution (in the aspect ratio used) and limited by soft corners, it still beats all shots I have seen from other phone cameras in terms of resolution, minus the Pureview. And scaled to the same output size, there's much less halos and other sharpening artifacts, even compared to some older ILC's.
Bigger pixels wouldn't have helped in that regard. At all.

Comment edited 3 times, last edit 3 minutes after posting
12 upvotes
Zlik
By Zlik (9 months ago)

Sensor size matters. When not in good light/tripod, the 5MP output should be much cleaner/sharper than anything else (except the 808) out there (smartphones).

2 upvotes
SimenO1
By SimenO1 (9 months ago)

Pixel size doesent matter much. Its sensor size that matters. 1,12 micron pixel pitch on full frame would have been 562 Mp. Quality when down scaled to 36 Mp would probably be close to D800E.

2 upvotes
stylinred
By stylinred (9 months ago)

Im no photographer at least i dont feel like one (not skilled as one and no camera), i simply love taking pics with my phone here are some 38mpx HDR shots i've done with my 808 handheld granted no examples of moving objects but if you check out the 808 groups on Flickr you'll find many full resolution action shots
http://www.flickr.com/photos/64809958@N03/7674340906/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/64809958@N03/8403316826/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/64809958@N03/8392357291/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/64809958@N03/8393356856/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/64809958@N03/8124579903/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/64809958@N03/8166099825/

Comment edited 1 minute after posting
1 upvote
familyogre
By familyogre (9 months ago)

I have the 808 and if it performs anything like that I'd recommend it to anyone. I won't be upgrading because symbian is fine for me but i would if i didn't already have the 808.

I use mine in 8mpx pureview mode most of the time so i hope this new one isn't limited to just full res & 5mpx

15 upvotes
jdpatl
By jdpatl (9 months ago)

Current version stores 5MP, or 38MP(4:3) & 5MP, or 34MP (16:9) & 5MP.

But that's software, I believe... would imagine it might change over time...

0 upvotes
Tonkotsu Ramen
By Tonkotsu Ramen (9 months ago)

no android or ios no care

4 upvotes
tinternaut
By tinternaut (9 months ago)

Never used Windows Phone 8 then?

8 upvotes
BaristaW
By BaristaW (9 months ago)

Actually not having android is probably the reason to use this. You know its a more power efficient and faster OS

13 upvotes
Cartagena Photo
By Cartagena Photo (9 months ago)

I had a 820, a 620 and a 800 Lumia as my work phone. Non of them can even remotely compete with my private Samsung Galaxy S4. Also in battery use the Nokias eat batteries and the 620 restart from time to time buy it self.

The Amoled screen on the 820 is extreemly wounerable to drops as we had at least 3 at my work with cracks and therefore ruined amoled screens. My own 820 was dropped 3 times and then suddenly one day where I hadden touched the phone the inner amoled screen had a long crack.

The ui is slow compared to android, especially because it takes so many click just to start the wifi or bluetooth. Really annoying. Also the cameras are no real competition to the Galaxy S4.

Kind regards
David

2 upvotes
ptox
By ptox (9 months ago)

David: so you're saying that low/midrange phones don't compare well to flagship phones? Good to know. Got it.

3 upvotes
jdpatl
By jdpatl (9 months ago)

David -

First, battery issues in some Lumias are the result of three general problems - (1) Firmware that hasn't been updated with tuning; (2) Too many features turned on unneccessarily (location, NFC, WiFi, some background apps); (3) Signal acquisition problems, where the phone has to work harder to keep a connection to the network - usually in specific areas.

Most of the common 920 battery issues from early in it's lifecycle have long since been fixed by updated firmware. Some Apps will just kill battery.

My 920 and 1020 get about the same battery life with normal use; I rarely have to charge before the end of the day.

The 820 does not have Gorilla Glass 3, and there are lots of people that have posted that their dropped Lumia's survived when they were sure that they wouldn't. My 920 and 1020 have taken some abuse and come out fine. Of course, your mileage may vary; there is one person I know that is particularly good at breaking cell phone screens. Maybe you're just unlucky.

0 upvotes
3DSimmon
By 3DSimmon (9 months ago)

David, simply pin WiFi and Bluetooth to your start screen, one touch access, simple.

1 upvote
Gadgety
By Gadgety (9 months ago)

@jdpatl "My 920 and 1020 have taken some abuse and come out fine."

So you've had the 1020 for a while. Are you working for Nokia, Microsoft or one of the carriers?

0 upvotes
qianp2k
By qianp2k (9 months ago)

When DXOMark will test this 41mp cellphone camera or older 41mp 808 cellphone camera? I want to see their P-MPix, guess no more than 5 mpix :-)

Comment edited 38 seconds after posting
2 upvotes
TrojMacReady
By TrojMacReady (9 months ago)

It (the PureView) outresolves the older 12MP µ4/3 cameras with a decent lens. So I doubt that.

Comment edited 18 seconds after posting
6 upvotes
viking79
By viking79 (9 months ago)

The camera at f/2.2 based on a size of 7.85 mm x 5.9 mm (sensor is 1/1.5", but it doesn't use the full sensor) has a diffraction limit of 24 MP, and in this mode the camera has 38 MP, so it isn't that bad, depending on how good the lens is. For comparison the iPhone 4s has a 1/3.2" at f/2.4 so has a limit of 7 MP, so I imagine the Nokia will be a fair bit better than iPhone. Those are the theoretical best resolutions given a perfect lens.

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 3 minutes after posting
6 upvotes
Rage Joe
By Rage Joe (9 months ago)

Check Nokia 808 and the earth-ball in Studio comparison tool.
( and get mad that your dslr doesn't do any better. quit photography)

5 upvotes
supeyugin1
By supeyugin1 (9 months ago)

So basically Nokia sensor is between 1/1.7" and 1/1.6". I calculated diagonal to be 9.82mm, this gives 4.4x crop, while Samsung's diagonal is 7.8mm and a crop factor of 5.58x.
The difference is pretty small then.

0 upvotes
vv50
By vv50 (9 months ago)

numbers don't do any justice, let's put your "pretty small difference" in pictures. http://j.mp/18QNQjf
that 2mm diagonal difference isn't so small anymore

1 upvote
supeyugin1
By supeyugin1 (9 months ago)

No, the difference is like this:
http://cameraimagesensor.com/size/#190,105,175,b
Where Samsung is S4 zoom and Panasonic is Nokia 1020.

0 upvotes
vv50
By vv50 (9 months ago)

you can't apply the crop to just the 1020 and not to the 808. but just to use your logic, if the lx5 is the 1020, this is how large the difference is: http://www.digicamdb.com/compare/panasonic_lumix-dmc-lx5-vs-samsung_wb150f/ (hint: 62%)

0 upvotes
Hobbit13
By Hobbit13 (9 months ago)

DXOMark tested the Nokia 808 in 8MP modus, but they gave no absolute MPix value.

But if the 1020 scores an 5MP effective resolution in the DXOMark it would very good. Imagine having pixel-perfect 5MP shots, that would be perfect!!!

(5MP is enough for any application except poster printing)

3 upvotes
stylinred
By stylinred (9 months ago)

dxomark did test the 808 pureview

0 upvotes
halc
By halc (9 months ago)

Sample images look good for a smartphone:

http://www.photographyblog.com/news/official_nokia_lumia_1020_sample_images/

Yet :
- highlights are overexposed 2/3 stops or so
- plenty of noise even at ISO 100

The Nokia Camera Pro features are cool.

Shame about the Windows Phone OS, though.

3 upvotes
ptox
By ptox (9 months ago)

"Shame about the Windows Phone OS, though."

It's only a shame if you're obsessed with apps. Otherwise, it's the best mobile OS going.

18 upvotes
mad marty
By mad marty (9 months ago)

I'm glad it's Windows Phone and not the overloaded Android but that's just a matter of taste.

12 upvotes
BaristaW
By BaristaW (9 months ago)

>> Shame about the Windows Phone OS, though.

Why the negativity? You haven't used it at all right?

4 upvotes
brdeveloper
By brdeveloper (9 months ago)

"It's only a shame if you're obsessed with apps."

So why not Symbian? At least it had a FM transmitter, usb on-the-go, hdmi and a micro-sd slot.

Sometimes I think that all of these Symbian-blaming was promoted by the US media which is xenophobic concerning foreign brands and operating systems.

Frankly, what advantages WP8 has over Symbian after 2 years from the announcement that it would be discontinued?

4 upvotes
vv50
By vv50 (9 months ago)

symbian belle fp2 has no skype video calling, native cloud storage integration, caldav / webdav syncing, or a kid-safe mode.

0 upvotes
Gadgety
By Gadgety (9 months ago)

@ptox "It's only a shame if you're obsessed with apps."

It depends on your definition of obsessed. I NEED one app for organizing tasks. I depend on it. Am I "obsessed by apps" - well only this one, but not in general. It's available for the PC, iPhone/iPad, Android, BlackBerry, and Windows Mobile. Not WP. The developer says the uptake is too small to develop for WP as of today, at least.

Other details, WP doesn't do VPN. And it's supposed to be for the corporate market. Let's see what the next update of WP, the Blue, brings.

0 upvotes
stylinred
By stylinred (9 months ago)

@Ptox OS is really subjective matter imo Symbian>All and in yours WP>All and in Halc something else>all

@vv50 there's cloud storage in symb

Comment edited 59 seconds after posting
0 upvotes
jdob123
By jdob123 (9 months ago)

A >35% percent shrinkage in sensor area makes it a mere good phone cam. With RX100 there is no chance against pocket cams anymore, unlike when the 808 came out. It won't hurt if this becomes more popular, but now the mobile phones went back to the megapixel race.

3 upvotes
wlad
By wlad (9 months ago)

those 41MP are not there for a "megapixel race" - it's the whole idea behind Pureview - the sensor captures a ridiculously high resolution and downsamples it to "normal" resolution of about 8MP.
The resulting image looks better than what a native 8MP sensor would capture.

1 upvote
SimenO1
By SimenO1 (9 months ago)

BSI and larger aperture makes up for the sensor shrinkage, thus remaing image quality from 1,5 years ago. Nokia could have buildt it the same size resulting in a fat phone like 808. I think its a good priority to slim it down a bit, even if it sets quality back to february 2012.

wlad: Downsizing is great. Cropping zoom is like using a smaller sensor. Thats not so great.

1 upvote
halc
By halc (9 months ago)

SimenO1 :
"BSI and larger aperture makes up for the sensor shrinkage, thus remaing image quality from 1,5 years ago"

No they dont.

BSI destroys highlights and introduces daylight noise,

It's all there in the sample images. Look for yourself.

0 upvotes
techmine
By techmine (9 months ago)

Nokia is fast alienating itself from the most serious camera or smartphone users, by providing this technology in "Windows only" phones. After 808 launch, people had some hope of seeing the sensor+optics on Android (at the very least). Too bad ain't gonna happen.

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting
3 upvotes
theranman
By theranman (9 months ago)

Not to mention the fact that it's only available on ATT. Phhhht.

2 upvotes
ptox
By ptox (9 months ago)

What proof do you have that "serious camera and smartphone users" would not want a Windows Phone?

It's a hell of a good OS--more innovative and usable than iOS or Android (the latter by far).

14 upvotes
wansai
By wansai (9 months ago)

are you suggesting that most serious camera people prefer using android?

and let's just say I am a more serious smartphone user than most smartphone user. I have 5 android devices here with me and my last android was a SGS3 and I still prefer my 3 year old Windows Phone 7 (HD7). I've been using smartphones since 2000's.

please don't speak up for all us "serious" smartphone users and "serious" photographers.

8 upvotes
tinternaut
By tinternaut (9 months ago)

This phone will help grow Windows Phone at the high end. At the moment, Windows Phone does reasonably well at the low end because it can offer an experience as slck as an iPhone 5, in a £100 phone. Now, we have a high end Windows Phone that is every bit as compelling as an iPhone or Samsung S4, for the first time.

3 upvotes
BaristaW
By BaristaW (9 months ago)

>> Nokia is fast alienating itself from the most serious camera or smartphone users, by providing this technology in "Windows only" phones.

Discounting the fact that Windows OS is a far better OS than iOS, do you really think a serious camera user will care about the OS than the camera quality? Even the Nokia 920 beats the daylights out of an iPhone.

2 upvotes
wlad
By wlad (9 months ago)

the last time Nokia announced a 41MP camera phone, most people ridiculed it with comments comparing it to the D800.

Where are those people now ?

8 upvotes
Petrogel
By Petrogel (9 months ago)

Be patient, ........ if you comment they will come ;-)

7 upvotes
Boerseuntjie
By Boerseuntjie (9 months ago)

Very cool love the Camera grip, suck that Samsuck...LOL

6 upvotes
supeyugin1
By supeyugin1 (9 months ago)

Yes, it will make it bigger than Samsung, but still no replaceable battery, no SD card slot, pixel size is smaller than Samsung, windows POJ. I'll pass.

5 upvotes
BaristaW
By BaristaW (9 months ago)

It's a camera phone not DSLR. and about windows POJ, care to expand? I bet you haven't used a windows phone yet.

1 upvote
supeyugin1
By supeyugin1 (9 months ago)

Used windows phones from WM5.0 to WM6.5. After that, switched to Android, after MS switched to closed OS.

0 upvotes
Zlik
By Zlik (9 months ago)

@ supeyugin1 "pixel size is smaller than Samsung"

Pixel size doesn't matter. Sensor size matters. A 12MP full frame camera or a 36MP full frame camera has almost the same high ISO performance. A 36MP full frame camera has much better high ISO performance than a 12MP APS-C camera, even though its individual pixels are smaller. It's the total amount of pixels x pixel size that is important. And again, that's sensor size.

4 upvotes
supeyugin1
By supeyugin1 (9 months ago)

I don't buy that. Also Nokia has no optical zoom.

1 upvote
supeyugin1
By supeyugin1 (9 months ago)

The sensor size on Nokia is marginally larger than the one on Samsung. And Samsung starts from 24mm and not from 26mm.

0 upvotes
vv50
By vv50 (9 months ago)

so doesn't practically all smartphones. except your favorite G4 zoom, which has a far slower lens and tiny sensor - it's a daylight camera.

0 upvotes
BaristaW
By BaristaW (9 months ago)

@supeyugin1, The windows phone that you speak of are old OS called Windows mobile that Microsoft has replaced a few years ago. The new windows phones are much sleeker.

0 upvotes
supeyugin1
By supeyugin1 (9 months ago)

WM was a great OS, but MS replaced it with a POS WP. That's why I switched to Android. Had 4 WM phones in a row, before Android and iPhone were on a market.

Comment edited 57 seconds after posting
1 upvote
ptox
By ptox (9 months ago)

@supeyugin1: You really believe Windows Mobile is superior to Windows Phone? You must be a masochist.

No wonder you switched to Android.

Comment edited 15 seconds after posting
1 upvote
supeyugin1
By supeyugin1 (9 months ago)

1/1.5" is the same as 2/3", so it's the same size as Fuji uses in their X20 and XF1, and just a bit bigger than 1/1.7"

3 upvotes
brdeveloper
By brdeveloper (9 months ago)

http://pureviewclub.com/2013/15270
– Sensor size 1/1.5”, 41MP, pixel size 1.1 micron, true 16:9/4:3 aspect ratio

So it's not competitor for N808. It's remotely possible it will outperform its Symbian bigger sensor brother.

4 upvotes
preeman80
By preeman80 (9 months ago)

It is 1.12 compared to 1.4.

However it uses BSI instead of FSI sensor. Also f2.2 instead of f2.4. And a better lens set.

6 upvotes
brdeveloper
By brdeveloper (9 months ago)

@preeman80, only serious reviews will prove that a big decrease on sensor size will give the same performance of its older brother.

I remember when L920 was launched. Most people said its OIS just as its brighter lens would give virtually the same performance as N808 which wasn't really true. In truth, even 12MP Nokia N8 is still better than N808 on the dynamic range side but I would buy a N808 because of its bigger screen, better processor and more versatility.

3 upvotes
robbo d
By robbo d (9 months ago)

Hmmm, did a comparison at work some while ago.
My HTC using HDR, an N8 and an 920.
Winner by far in dynamic range into a sunset was the 920, second using HDR(cheating) was the HTC and then the N8.
I'd say the n8 on producing large images would have been far better, but straight out of the box jpeg was the 920 by a country mile. Just later image processing I suppose. Maybe the N8 could have pulled some shadows out with some PP??

3 upvotes
peevee1
By peevee1 (9 months ago)

If it is "true 16:9/4:3 aspect ratio", it means that the image circle of the lens does not even cover the whole 2/3" sensor, so actually used part of the sensor is even smaller.

1 upvote
brdeveloper
By brdeveloper (9 months ago)

Is the sensor as big as the N808's 1/1.2" ? If not, I'm better going to buy a 2nd-hand N808. As a bonus, I get fm transmitter, hdmi port, usb on-the-go and a micro-sd card slot. Symbian was way better in connectivity than WP8.

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting
7 upvotes
vv50
By vv50 (9 months ago)

but handheld video would be shaky

0 upvotes
Hobbit13
By Hobbit13 (9 months ago)

I have the 808, and seriously conciser buying this one, to get rid of Symbian.

Symbian is dead, there are no new apps, it can only sync to Exchange.

2 upvotes
vv50
By vv50 (9 months ago)

symbian is living dead - it just doesn't go away

1 upvote
robbo d
By robbo d (9 months ago)

Hoping for a faster roll out to places other than the states. This is most definitely the phone ive been waiting on and to replace my now aging HTC. It is re defining photography.
Still no match for the versatility of a DSLR for specialised photography, but in a small package, that's amazing IQ.
Telstra Australia, please take note.....

2 upvotes
preeman80
By preeman80 (9 months ago)

I am hoping that I can pick one up in USA and bring it back. Who know when we will get it here.

2 upvotes
Total comments: 147
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